I’ve told people plenty of times that Wuhan’s Level 4 biosafety lab was a level 4 for a reason. They weren’t studying the sniffles. These labs have so many layers of confinement for a reason, but putting one in a country with no morals, no ethics, poor hygiene, it spells disaster.
Coronavirus: China expands export checks on medical products to tighten quality control after complaints from buyers about substandard products like masks, ventilators etc..https://www.scmp.com/news/china/society/article/3079444/coronavirus-china-expands-export-checks-medical-products-tighten
South Korean officials on Friday reported that 91 patients thought cleared of the new coronavirus had tested positive again. False test results could also be at fault, other experts said, or remnants of the virus could still be in patients' systems but not be infectious or of danger to the host or others.
"There are different interpretations and many variables." https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/south-korea-coronavirus-covid19-reactivated-positive-1.5529066?cmp=rss
Although I know once we get past the "oh my God" part of this,and we can spend time figuring out just who to blame; (or what group of who) - I have little problem placing it on the Wuhanmorons for letting it off the leash. However, an interesting post that I saw from 'capitalist Eric' made me think that something that this virulent and horrible was likely developed here at good ol' Fort Detrick, 'assisted' by the University of North Carolina - Chapel Hill... something like this took a group of mad scientists with no thought of what the eff might happen. A question for the group would be "and, WTF were you thinking about?" With all the world watching and asking, I can't help but think that eventually we get around to the who did this. When we do, hanging by their thumbs while everybody on the planet gets to walk by and take a swing at them seems like a fairly equal and appropriate punishment. And good work, brother; sending the children out of the room. They never even displayed the courtesy to just sit at the kid's table. Be safe as you can, devil dog.
However, an interesting post that I saw from 'capitalist Eric' made me think that something that this virulent and horrible was likely developed here at good ol' Fort Detrick, 'assisted' by the University of North Carolina - Chapel Hill... something like this took a group of mad scientists with no thought of what the eff might happen. A question for the group would be "and, WTF were you thinking about?"
It would seem the "Mad Scientist" trope is not entirely unfounded. Here's the paper in question, I haven't more than glanced at it yet because every bit of effort invested in this question right now for planning and action is wasted, the virus is what it is. And something of a waste of time for me until I read Molecular Biology of the Gene and Molecular Biology of the SARS-Coronavirus. Which isn't particularly important before I'll be wanting to judge vaccines for Corona-chan.
But it appears to be gain of function research, which the US has twice placed moratoriums on, first because of a group with as I recall inadequate isolation (BSL-3, or maybe even BSL-2) passed a bird flu through a series of ferrets to make it transmit better in mammals, ferrets are a preferred animal model for human respiratory infection. Then a broader moratorium on coronavirus research of this type, which the news item Capitalist Eric linked to mentioned, here's his posting, and based on that and perhaps one other I read, I advise ignoring him.
For example, "was likely developed here at good ol' Fort Detrick" is blind conspiracy mongering, that paper for example did not have anyone from the US military formally involved, and you certainly don't need them to do this sort of research, unless you're sane (and they've been having issues with their BSL-4 lab due to a new system not working as planned).
It should go without saying this research is by definition extraordinarily dangerous, the excuse for doing it is that if or when it happens in nature, as with SARS-CoV, bat -> civet likely in a wet market -> human, or MERS-CoV, bat -> camels who still have it -> humans who are still getting it, we'll be better prepared.
And I would say the above explanation, in short, "making deadly viruses work better in animals like humans is dangerous" is evident to the average citizen. But that doesn't mean you have to go further. For example, based on what we've heard of the initial locations of infections, which could well be sanitized by the CCP, I think, if this was the source, it was from experiments in the facility a few blocks from the wet market, which tops out at BSL-3 labs, and no doubt also has BSL-2 ones. Rather than the infamous facility 9? miles away with the PRC's first public BSL-4 lab.
I.e. if this sort of non-military research was being done---non-military to begin with, germ warfare spooks don't tend to publicize details about their work a Nature journal, the original Nature being the most prestigious science journal in the world---if done there, an escape would be more likely, and would produce the CCP claimed pattern of early cases.
So no grand conspriacy, just people stupid enough to do research in a culture and country that's too sloppy to do it safely. A suspected real biowarefare lab in the PRC has been linked to a number of local epidemics, and it's a matter of record one or more labs in Beijing screwed up and accidentally released SARS-CoV once or twice.
[Year-on-year change for the same category is generally a reliable yardstick.] "How Many People Have Actually Died From Coronavirus in New York?" The official statistics paint a partial picture and may understate the death toll. Here’s why.
In the first five days of April, 1,125 people were pronounced dead in their homes or on the street in New York City, more than eight times the deaths recorded during the same period in 2019, according to the Fire Department.
Many of these deaths were probably caused by Covid-19, but were not accounted for in the coronavirus tallies given by Gov. Andrew M. Cuomo during his widely watched daily news conferences — statistics that are viewed as key measures of the impact of the outbreak.
On Thursday, Mr. Cuomo said 799 people in New York had died from coronavirus in a single 24-hour period — more than 33 an hour — bringing the state’s total to 7,067.
But epidemiologists, city officials and medical personnel say those numbers are likely to be far below the city’s actual death toll.
The data on deaths of people in their homes or on the street shows that the state’s statistics don’t tell the whole story. Here’s what we know: NYT, April 10, 2020
I’ve told people plenty of times that Wuhan’s Level 4 biosafety lab was a level 4 for a reason. They weren’t studying the sniffles. These labs have so many layers of confinement for a reason, but putting one in a country with no morals, no ethics, poor hygiene, it spells disaster.
ReplyDeleteCoronavirus: China expands export checks on medical products to tighten quality control after complaints from buyers about substandard products like masks, ventilators etc..https://www.scmp.com/news/china/society/article/3079444/coronavirus-china-expands-export-checks-medical-products-tighten
ReplyDeleteSouth Korean officials on Friday reported that 91 patients thought cleared of the new coronavirus had tested positive again. False test results could also be at fault, other experts said, or remnants of the virus could still be in patients' systems but not be infectious or of danger to the host or others.
ReplyDelete"There are different interpretations and many variables."
https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/south-korea-coronavirus-covid19-reactivated-positive-1.5529066?cmp=rss
Although I know once we get past the "oh my God" part of this,and we can spend time figuring out just who to blame; (or what group of who) - I have little problem placing it on the Wuhanmorons for letting it off the leash. However, an interesting post that I saw from 'capitalist Eric' made me think that something that this virulent and horrible was likely developed here at good ol' Fort Detrick, 'assisted' by the University of North Carolina - Chapel Hill... something like this took a group of mad scientists with no thought of what the eff might happen. A question for the group would be "and, WTF were you thinking about?" With all the world watching and asking, I can't help but think that eventually we get around to the who did this. When we do, hanging by their thumbs while everybody on the planet gets to walk by and take a swing at them seems like a fairly equal and appropriate punishment.
ReplyDeleteAnd good work, brother; sending the children out of the room. They never even displayed the courtesy to just sit at the kid's table. Be safe as you can, devil dog.
Holding my breath for a Fatal Attraction meme follow-up to Gilligan Wang.
ReplyDeleteAsk, and ye shall receive...
ReplyDeleteHowever, an interesting post that I saw from 'capitalist Eric' made me think that something that this virulent and horrible was likely developed here at good ol' Fort Detrick, 'assisted' by the University of North Carolina - Chapel Hill... something like this took a group of mad scientists with no thought of what the eff might happen. A question for the group would be "and, WTF were you thinking about?"
ReplyDeleteIt would seem the "Mad Scientist" trope is not entirely unfounded. Here's the paper in question, I haven't more than glanced at it yet because every bit of effort invested in this question right now for planning and action is wasted, the virus is what it is. And something of a waste of time for me until I read Molecular Biology of the Gene and Molecular Biology of the SARS-Coronavirus. Which isn't particularly important before I'll be wanting to judge vaccines for Corona-chan.
But it appears to be gain of function research, which the US has twice placed moratoriums on, first because of a group with as I recall inadequate isolation (BSL-3, or maybe even BSL-2) passed a bird flu through a series of ferrets to make it transmit better in mammals, ferrets are a preferred animal model for human respiratory infection. Then a broader moratorium on coronavirus research of this type, which the news item Capitalist Eric linked to mentioned, here's his posting, and based on that and perhaps one other I read, I advise ignoring him.
For example, "was likely developed here at good ol' Fort Detrick" is blind conspiracy mongering, that paper for example did not have anyone from the US military formally involved, and you certainly don't need them to do this sort of research, unless you're sane (and they've been having issues with their BSL-4 lab due to a new system not working as planned).
It should go without saying this research is by definition extraordinarily dangerous, the excuse for doing it is that if or when it happens in nature, as with SARS-CoV, bat -> civet likely in a wet market -> human, or MERS-CoV, bat -> camels who still have it -> humans who are still getting it, we'll be better prepared.
And I would say the above explanation, in short, "making deadly viruses work better in animals like humans is dangerous" is evident to the average citizen. But that doesn't mean you have to go further. For example, based on what we've heard of the initial locations of infections, which could well be sanitized by the CCP, I think, if this was the source, it was from experiments in the facility a few blocks from the wet market, which tops out at BSL-3 labs, and no doubt also has BSL-2 ones. Rather than the infamous facility 9? miles away with the PRC's first public BSL-4 lab.
I.e. if this sort of non-military research was being done---non-military to begin with, germ warfare spooks don't tend to publicize details about their work a Nature journal, the original Nature being the most prestigious science journal in the world---if done there, an escape would be more likely, and would produce the CCP claimed pattern of early cases.
So no grand conspriacy, just people stupid enough to do research in a culture and country that's too sloppy to do it safely. A suspected real biowarefare lab in the PRC has been linked to a number of local epidemics, and it's a matter of record one or more labs in Beijing screwed up and accidentally released SARS-CoV once or twice.
[Year-on-year change for the same category is generally a reliable yardstick.]
ReplyDelete"How Many People Have Actually Died From Coronavirus in New York?"
The official statistics paint a partial picture and may understate the death toll. Here’s why.
In the first five days of April, 1,125 people were pronounced dead in their homes or on the street in New York City, more than eight times the deaths recorded during the same period in 2019, according to the Fire Department.
Many of these deaths were probably caused by Covid-19, but were not accounted for in the coronavirus tallies given by Gov. Andrew M. Cuomo during his widely watched daily news conferences — statistics that are viewed as key measures of the impact of the outbreak.
On Thursday, Mr. Cuomo said 799 people in New York had died from coronavirus in a single 24-hour period — more than 33 an hour — bringing the state’s total to 7,067.
But epidemiologists, city officials and medical personnel say those numbers are likely to be far below the city’s actual death toll.
The data on deaths of people in their homes or on the street shows that the state’s statistics don’t tell the whole story. Here’s what we know:
NYT, April 10, 2020
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/10/nyregion/new-york-coronavirus-death-count.html